Post by Kjell Dahn on Feb 20, 2018 3:21:14 GMT -6
Okay, I know what the staff's first thoughts on balancing this might be, but sit back and hear me out. With the way permanent and temporary transformations work in tandem with BP, I feel like there is a viable way to make Kaioken, a big part of early DBZ, a viable part of the forum. I have suggestions on how to make it work, obviously, and that's what this topic is about!
First, we need to restate how transformations work for reference and posterity.
Some may be familiar with the PERMANENT transformation system. When in one of these forms, while you are not ICly forced to be in it permanently, it has an indefinite supply of ki that regenerates, should you not use KP for a post. Forms with the Permanent labelling, along with your base form, function this way. You have a 3KP cap in Permanent forms, but you will not drop out of your transformation should you hit 0KP. As said before, if you don't use a KP tech in a post, you regenerate 1KP. Permanent forms have the ability to Dig Deep as well. Even if they don't seem to have sufficient KP, they can dive into the negative KP range to dish out extra damage, though this wears on their health and stamina big-time. The lower your KP, the more damage you take- (*0/3 KP>No damage, -1/3 KP>Moderate Damage, -2/3 KP>Heavy Damage, -3/3 KP or Below>Death). When you are in the negatives, you cannot use any KP techs until you're back at 1 or above.
Next come TEMPORARY transformations. These forms are all-out barrage-based forms that wear opponents down fast, but also wear you down- contrasting the lasting, endurance-based playstyle of PERMANENT forms. In a temporary transformed state, you cap out at 7 KP. Should you transform with 3 KP, you'll total with 7/7, transform with two and get 4/7, and 1 KP gets you 2/7. These forms, while generally more powerful than permanent forms of the same tier, regain KP at a slower pace. You need to not use a tech for two consecutive posts in order to gain 1KP back to your form. Should you drop to 0/7KP, you will return to your nearest permanent transformation or base form.
Kaioken is a desperation attack first and foremost. It should be treated as a transformation steroid. My suggestion for power scaling is that it boosts your PL multiplier by 3 if you only have your most basic transformation(Your starting forms), but boosts your current multiplier by 2 if you are at any transformation level beyond your starting forms. (For example, Oozaru for Saiyan is a default form, so if you somehow mastered it and used Kaioken in Oozaru it would be a x8 instead of a x5 because Oozaru is a basic form that you start with. Same for Arcosian's True Form(Normally a x6, but can be boosted to x9 with Kaioken).
However, for an Arcosian's True Form Full Powered(x12), Kaioken only boosts it to a x14 instead of a x15. This is to tone down the boost from Kaioken so that those who already have a sufficient PL to achieve Super Saiyan equivalent power or have to think more on whether the drawbacks are worth it or not. Any race with a basic x2 starting out will be able to achieve x5, enough to stand against a Saiyan's Oozaru or to hold their own against an Arcosian's x6 True form, but only for a very brief time. Chances are, they'll still lose unless they strike a decisive blow in that time. And even then, if it's not a crippling blow, they will still likely end up losing very badly.
The reason that Kaioken can both win and lose fights is for one reason. It amps up the drain on ANY form you use it in significantly. For Permanent forms of all types, the drawback is simple, but severe. Your form becomes a Temporary form, giving you the standard burst of KP(Up to 7/7), but the form itself drains 1KP a turn. This means that, no matter what you do, eventually you will run out of KP. Even if you use no techniques at all while Kaioken is active, you'll only have the boost to power for at max 7 turns. On top of this max ki increase and steady drain, Permanent forms using Kaioken cannot Dig Deep anymore because their form has become effectively 'temporary'. If they should maintain Kaioken until their KP hits 0, they will either fall completely unconscious and be 100% exhausted in non-DE threads. In DE threads they will fall comatose and die in 3 turns if they are not given medical attention before they perish.
Temporary forms are already known to be draining on their own, as the put limits on how quickly you regain KP. With Kaioken activated on a temporary form, the form gains additional buffs and drawbacks. The form maximum KP remains at 7/7, but using Kaioken in a Temporary form grants 3KP immediately. If you are at 4/7 KP then it boosts you to 7/7. If you are at 7/7 it boosts you to 10/7. With a temporary form, however, you cannot activate and deactivate Kaioken at will. Deactivating Kaioken means deactivating the entire transformation, the Temporary form you're using in conjunction with Kaioken will be reverted to the closest permanent form below that if you end Kaioken before your KP is refreshed to full. On top of this, using all available KP in a Temporary form boosted by Kaioken results in heavy injury in a non-DE thread, so even if you wake up from being unconscious you will have damaged muscles, and a KP pool of 1/1 for the remainder of the thread. For DE threads, if your KP pool reaches 0 while in Kaioken using a temporary form, you die on the turn after the form ends. In other words, someone has to heal you IMMEDIATELY when your last bit of energy fades or your body will collapse internally, organs failing, resulting in your demise for pushing your body too hard.
Also! As Kaioken is a LEARNABLE transformation, I figured it would require a Technique Slot to be learned for every transformation beyond your starting/basic forms that you intend to use in conjunction with Kaioken. This means to keep Kaioken available at your highest form, you will need to expend numerous Tech slots in the late game so that your mastery of the technique is up to form.
In closing, I just had some ideas to make this a thing...and I had to get 'em out there. Whether they bare fruit or not isn't my concern. It's just ideas I had that others may have interest in! Feel free to discuss.
Majin Mumbo Maple Sketch Tanga
First, we need to restate how transformations work for reference and posterity.
Some may be familiar with the PERMANENT transformation system. When in one of these forms, while you are not ICly forced to be in it permanently, it has an indefinite supply of ki that regenerates, should you not use KP for a post. Forms with the Permanent labelling, along with your base form, function this way. You have a 3KP cap in Permanent forms, but you will not drop out of your transformation should you hit 0KP. As said before, if you don't use a KP tech in a post, you regenerate 1KP. Permanent forms have the ability to Dig Deep as well. Even if they don't seem to have sufficient KP, they can dive into the negative KP range to dish out extra damage, though this wears on their health and stamina big-time. The lower your KP, the more damage you take- (*0/3 KP>No damage, -1/3 KP>Moderate Damage, -2/3 KP>Heavy Damage, -3/3 KP or Below>Death). When you are in the negatives, you cannot use any KP techs until you're back at 1 or above.
Next come TEMPORARY transformations. These forms are all-out barrage-based forms that wear opponents down fast, but also wear you down- contrasting the lasting, endurance-based playstyle of PERMANENT forms. In a temporary transformed state, you cap out at 7 KP. Should you transform with 3 KP, you'll total with 7/7, transform with two and get 4/7, and 1 KP gets you 2/7. These forms, while generally more powerful than permanent forms of the same tier, regain KP at a slower pace. You need to not use a tech for two consecutive posts in order to gain 1KP back to your form. Should you drop to 0/7KP, you will return to your nearest permanent transformation or base form.
Kaioken is a desperation attack first and foremost. It should be treated as a transformation steroid. My suggestion for power scaling is that it boosts your PL multiplier by 3 if you only have your most basic transformation(Your starting forms), but boosts your current multiplier by 2 if you are at any transformation level beyond your starting forms. (For example, Oozaru for Saiyan is a default form, so if you somehow mastered it and used Kaioken in Oozaru it would be a x8 instead of a x5 because Oozaru is a basic form that you start with. Same for Arcosian's True Form(Normally a x6, but can be boosted to x9 with Kaioken).
However, for an Arcosian's True Form Full Powered(x12), Kaioken only boosts it to a x14 instead of a x15. This is to tone down the boost from Kaioken so that those who already have a sufficient PL to achieve Super Saiyan equivalent power or have to think more on whether the drawbacks are worth it or not. Any race with a basic x2 starting out will be able to achieve x5, enough to stand against a Saiyan's Oozaru or to hold their own against an Arcosian's x6 True form, but only for a very brief time. Chances are, they'll still lose unless they strike a decisive blow in that time. And even then, if it's not a crippling blow, they will still likely end up losing very badly.
The reason that Kaioken can both win and lose fights is for one reason. It amps up the drain on ANY form you use it in significantly. For Permanent forms of all types, the drawback is simple, but severe. Your form becomes a Temporary form, giving you the standard burst of KP(Up to 7/7), but the form itself drains 1KP a turn. This means that, no matter what you do, eventually you will run out of KP. Even if you use no techniques at all while Kaioken is active, you'll only have the boost to power for at max 7 turns. On top of this max ki increase and steady drain, Permanent forms using Kaioken cannot Dig Deep anymore because their form has become effectively 'temporary'. If they should maintain Kaioken until their KP hits 0, they will either fall completely unconscious and be 100% exhausted in non-DE threads. In DE threads they will fall comatose and die in 3 turns if they are not given medical attention before they perish.
Temporary forms are already known to be draining on their own, as the put limits on how quickly you regain KP. With Kaioken activated on a temporary form, the form gains additional buffs and drawbacks. The form maximum KP remains at 7/7, but using Kaioken in a Temporary form grants 3KP immediately. If you are at 4/7 KP then it boosts you to 7/7. If you are at 7/7 it boosts you to 10/7. With a temporary form, however, you cannot activate and deactivate Kaioken at will. Deactivating Kaioken means deactivating the entire transformation, the Temporary form you're using in conjunction with Kaioken will be reverted to the closest permanent form below that if you end Kaioken before your KP is refreshed to full. On top of this, using all available KP in a Temporary form boosted by Kaioken results in heavy injury in a non-DE thread, so even if you wake up from being unconscious you will have damaged muscles, and a KP pool of 1/1 for the remainder of the thread. For DE threads, if your KP pool reaches 0 while in Kaioken using a temporary form, you die on the turn after the form ends. In other words, someone has to heal you IMMEDIATELY when your last bit of energy fades or your body will collapse internally, organs failing, resulting in your demise for pushing your body too hard.
Also! As Kaioken is a LEARNABLE transformation, I figured it would require a Technique Slot to be learned for every transformation beyond your starting/basic forms that you intend to use in conjunction with Kaioken. This means to keep Kaioken available at your highest form, you will need to expend numerous Tech slots in the late game so that your mastery of the technique is up to form.
In closing, I just had some ideas to make this a thing...and I had to get 'em out there. Whether they bare fruit or not isn't my concern. It's just ideas I had that others may have interest in! Feel free to discuss.
Majin Mumbo Maple Sketch Tanga
I believe on Souls they had a system for it, and Kaioken was (and probably still will be) only available through the selective tutelage of the Afterlife
